Brave, and selfless, and smart, and kind, and honest...

Discuss the June 2014 book of the month Divergent by Veronica Roth. While only Divergent--the first book of the series--is the book of the month, feel free to use this subforum to discuss the rest of the series or to talk about the movies, but make sure not to post spoilers unless noted in the topic title.
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Re: Brave, and selfless, and smart, and kind, and honest...

Post by ElphabaEvans » 04 Jan 2015, 19:23

Without broadcasting it widely and thus being openly Divergent, it is still possible. Nothing says Dauntless can't be honest- how complicated would that be if everyone but Candor lied ALL the time? It wouldn't be the wiser on his society, but in ours it is necessary to have many skills and values to forge connections between people who seemingly have little in common.

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Post by melbuhtoast » 19 Feb 2015, 13:18

I think it is realistic. People can be many things, even if they're described by one trait - his being dauntless. He DID exhibit all of these qualities as far as I am concerned. It may not have been the accepted norm, but that's okay.

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Post by csimmons032 » 09 Mar 2015, 16:49

His goal is admirable, but it's not realistic, in my opinion. He lives in a world where people can really have only one attribute, unless you are Divergent. Even being Divergent, it is hard to be all of those things because everyone has some sort of flaw. For example, you can be brave and kind, but not necessarily honest, or honest and smart but not necessarily brave. That's kind of what makes everyone different from one another. We all wish that we can be all of those things, but when it comes down to it, sometimes we are not. There is always something that someone has a difficult time with. So that is why I don't think Four's view is realistic for the world that he lives in.

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Post by Jesska6029 » 10 Mar 2015, 16:58

toriborip wrote:Its not very practical where they live because they are forced to choose one... But honestly I think everyone should strive to be all of those things

I completely agree with you. The society in Divergent forces each person to choose just one. I think it is impossible for a person in our society to choose only one. We are taught to be selfless, compassionate, brave, etc., but we need to make the choice to act on what we are taught. I think people should strive to be all of those things. It's not just about bettering society, but about bettering ourselves.
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Post by gatorgirl_823 » 31 Mar 2015, 13:03

When Four was in Dauntless, he was expected to uphold the values of Dauntless over all else. When the book ended, he was much more free to exhibit all the positive traits he had inside him the entire time.

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Post by steinhm » 02 Apr 2015, 05:17

I think Four’s desire to be brave, and selfless, and smart, kind, and honest is not really realistic in his society and especially not in dauntless. Being "smart, kind and honest" don't really fit. It's not that it's necessarily against the society, but a certain faction doesn't allow you to be all of those things at once.

Even in our society it's almost "selfish" to want to be all of those things and each of those things vary by different cultures. Selfless in America isn't the same as selfless in India and so on.

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Post by Momlovesbooks » 14 Apr 2015, 13:57

I believe most people would like to achieve those traits. However, in Four's society, those traits combined would label him Divergent. To his society, that was not normal and should be eliminated. However, as the faction system starts to fall apart, striving to reach those qualities becomes one of Four's strengths.

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Post by abasto123 » 19 Apr 2015, 03:11

I think it's realistic although majority frowned upon, one or more people being different could change the aspects of their factions and lives. Change the way they live.

-- 19 Apr 2015, 03:12 --

I think it's realistic although majority frowned upon, one or more people being different could change the aspects of their factions and lives. Change the way they live.

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Post by Lovely_Loreley » 13 May 2015, 23:45

To desire to be a good person is realistic no matter what society one lives in, as far as I am concerned. If we only desired to be what we knew was already possible, society would be static. Nobody would change or grow, and it would be so boring! Now, actually living out that desire to be "all good things" probably would have been problematic in Four's case. Obviously society did not approve, and went to great lengths to define everyone by one dominant trait. Did that make his dream an impossible dream? No; it simply made the journey harder. Sometimes that can be a good thing!

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Post by abasto123 » 19 Jun 2015, 21:39

I believe it's a realistic goal to desire all four characteristics. However, I believe it would be incredibly hard to achieve and maintain.

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Post by tracy19 » 25 Jun 2015, 07:08

I personally don't think it's possible to be all in the society he lives in, but neither do I think it's possible in our society.

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Post by meganxxcooper » 30 Jun 2015, 08:20

It's not the most practical, but a well rounded person needs to feel all those ways. In our world there are people who do something once unheard of.

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Post by hannahbm13 » 20 Jul 2015, 13:55

I do not think that his desire is unrealistic. Everybody strives and pushes themselves to be as good as they can. Also, I don't think it would be easy for him, but that doesn't make it unrealistic.

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Post by hsimone » 20 Jul 2015, 19:51

I believe it would be extremely difficult for Four to be “brave, and selfless, and smart, and kind, and honest” (p. 405) in main setting setting of the Divergent series, especially in the first book. He would have to almost hide the qualities that he isn't supposed to have in order to be everything he wants to be.

However, at the end when everything is more peaceful, I feel as if it is more likely. Being broken into factions, it was hard for Four's society to accept that one person could fit into more than one faction. It was something that wasn't spoken about because most believed it could never be true/was taught it wasn't true. However, once the enforcer of this unrealistic idea was taken down, now it is completely possible for people to discover that they may fit in to more than one "category/characteristic" and discover things about themselves that they may never thought possible.

Looking at people in our world today, everyone's personality is unique and mixed with several character traits. For instance, I know someone who is kind, giving, can control his fears, is extremely smart and inquisitive, and who is honest, which is what makes our society a lot more interesting.
"Love is patient, love is kind." -1 Corinthians 13:4

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Post by zjones99 » 20 Jul 2015, 21:46

I think it is realistic for him to want that. That IS the whole point of the divergent society is to find the genetically pure people and help society. He was also one of the GP people so I think he was pretty much at his goal. One big example of a person who bridges cultures is Oprah. She really relates to many people and she speaks the truth most always.

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