Beowulf

[ITemple]

I have read the story of Beowulf several times and have always enjoyed it. Throughout my experiences discussing it with others I have heard multiple theories on what Grendel is, what he looks like, and how he came to exist. (I have not yet had the opportunity to read the book titled "Grendel" though). I would love to hear any/all of the theories that you have or that you've heard!

One of the theories that I have heard is that in the Garden of Eden when Eve was persuaded to partake of the "forbidden fruit" it was not literally fruit; and she became pregnant with the serpent's child when she was cast out of the garden. Then as generations passed, that child's offspring evolved and Grendel is one of its descendants. Therefore he is a mix between reptile and human, with tough skin like a reptile but limbs like a human.

Another theory I have heard is that Grendel is a dragon, specifically he and his mother are the last of them. All the other dragons had been hunted down, tortured, and killed long before; but because Grendel's mother had learned to change her form to deceive men she had escaped that fate.
(But I think the first one is more interesting)

[saouad]

What translation of Beowulf have you read (unless of course you read in Old English)?

If you haven't read it already, I'd recommend Seamus Heaney's relatively more recent translation if you'd like to dig deeper into Grendel's nature and lineage.

I have to admit my last reading of Beowulf goes back a few years, but if memory serves, Grendel is a descendant of Cain, son of Adam and Eve, who committed fratricide by killing his brother Abel.

As for him being a dragon... I can't speak to supporting literature on the topic, but reading Beowulf did not give me that impression. I believe his mother may have been more akin to a sea monster (as Beowulf and she fight underwater), but here again the memory is a little shaky!

[soccerstar95]

I absolutely loved Beowulf because it fit in with what I like to read. Probably common knowledge, but Tolkien was supposed to have been influenced by this epic. Also, I keep thinking of Grendel as a creature mutated by nuclear disaster as in the novel Canticle for Leibowitz. He probably is closer to a sea monster type creature though, considering the time period in which this was written.

[acasto]

I'm not sure which translation I have read, but nowhere did I read anything about Adam, Eve, Cain and Abel. Grendel and his mother were portrayed as dragons. I actually did a huge project in school about Tolkein, and he was greatly influenced by this story in his writing of LotR.

[roguexunited]

In Heaney's translation, as well as the ones that appears in the Oxford and the Northon Anthologies of English Literature, they do mention that Grendel is one of those who are outcasts because they are descendants of Cain. Now, there are some who believe that the Christian content in the book was added by the monk who transcribed it, therefore some translators completely disregard it's presence, opening the path for other explanations about his origins.

Personally, I love Grendel, he is up there, next to Maleficent in the list of overreacting horrible neighbors. After all, he went after Hrogarth and his people because he disliked their merry making.

I am excited though because after 90 years they are finally going to publish Tolkien's own translation of the poem, so I have that to look forward to.

[thsavage2]

I recently read this for the first time and I was a bit disappointed. I thought it would be a grand epic, and it is in a way, just not the way I was expecting. I think the first paragraph is one of my favorites, especially since it just starts "So." Beowulf is great is you want to study the ideas of loyalty and bravery. Or if you like underwater battle scenes.

I never gave much thought to who Grendel was. It would make sense for him to be a descendant of Biblical stories, though.

[Ryan]

I loved Beowulf. I actually read Kevin Crossley-Holland's translation first (Oxford University Press) and then purchased Heaney's translation. Grendel is incredibly fascinating and there are already so many theories about what creature he is, but I think we can safely assume that he isn't a dragon: firstly, because there is already an identifiable dragon in the text, so it seems absurd to name one and not another; and secondly, the description of him resembles nothing like a dragon. Plus, when he attacks Beowulf he engages in a grapple and loses an arm, which is unlikely to happen if he were a dragon.

In Heaney's translation, as well as the ones that appears in the Oxford and the Northon Anthologies of English Literature, they do mention that Grendel is one of those who are outcasts because they are descendants of Cain. Now, there are some who believe that the Christian content in the book was added by the monk who transcribed it, therefore some translators completely disregard it's presence, opening the path for other explanations about his origins.

Such a great point! I think when reading Beowulf we have to be careful about its content, especially with anything relating to Christianity. If we assume that the text was written at the same time Bede was writing, then Christian overtones are certainly relevant, but if it's earlier then we have to be careful not to assume that Grendel should be considered a demon and instead realize that the text has had a long history of transcription with much possibly being altered. You also have to consider whether the tale had oral beginnings (typical of the period): if so, this would mean that the text would have been altered through several generations until final reaching the monk who had the skill to write it down. We therefore rely on their interpretation more than we can on any others. Anglo-Saxon literature is wonderfully self-contained: it seems to look only into the present.

[JessicaAnn123]

I just recently read Beowulf for a class I took. I love this story because Beowulf is such an interesting hero. Even in his older years as a king he fights to defend his people. I love his selflessness in that.

[AubreyN]

I agree with ryanj1 about his point of a duplicate dragon. I read something a long time about Grendel being a Giant (somewhat akin to a monster), but that was several years ago. Considering the text was supposedly altered after it fell into the hand(s) of religious writer(s), I would think it's still possible Grendel represents a demon. But I can also recognize that this text has a long history and, as such, Grendel could represent a variety of different creatures with different backgrounds (depending on when it was written and how many orators/authors were involved)

[CCtheBrave]

I recently read this for the first time and I was a bit disappointed. I thought it would be a grand epic, and it is in a way, just not the way I was expecting. I think the first paragraph is one of my favorites, especially since it just starts "So." Beowulf is great is you want to study the ideas of loyalty and bravery. Or if you like underwater battle scenes.

I never gave much thought to who Grendel was. It would make sense for him to be a descendant of Biblical stories, though.

If you're interested in reading more about Grendel, there's a novel titled "Grendel" by John Gardner, that is hilarious! This book really fleshes out the personality of Grendel and gives readers a cool take on the bad guy. There's a lot of hidden symbology and craft in this book, as well, and it's a short read.

[Wreade1872]

I thought it was decent but a bit hard to follow at times, pretty sure that was the translation though, read the old Francis Barton Gummere version.

I disagree with the assertion that it was a big influence on lord of the rings, an influence sure, mostly perhaps on the Hobbit than lotr but i think Sigurd the Volsung stuff had a bigger impact overall.

I recently read Sigurd the Volsung and the Fall of the Niblungs by William Morris, (i get most books online so forgive me if i'm not reading what people consider the best versions of these things). In the story you can see clearly that Aragorn is based on Sigurd, theres a Rivendell type place, the broken sword of his father which gets reforged, Brunhild plays Arwen's part and theres a woman who's the equivalent of Eowyn. There's also a Gandalf/Saruman type character who also happens to be a dwarf. And there's the ring which they call the Seed of Gold. You never really find out what it can do or how evil it is though.

Anyway, if you like Beowulf, Sigurd is worth a look although it does go on a bit too long, most of the lotr's stuff is in the first half.

[Keith80]

My translation of Beowulf is the R.K. Gordon one, and he simply refers to both Grendel and his mother as sea monsters. Because of the long fight under water between Beowulf and Grendel's mother I find this quite persuasive, as she would naturally seek out her favoured domain I expect. I am a bit suspicious of the old manuscripts which were copied out by monks as they were often guilty of some judicious 'editing' to promote their religious beliefs. They were the only ones who could write so could put in what they felt 'proper'. This is rather like the history books written by the winners of wars, but Beowulf is still a very fine adventure story. There are some real historical characters in there.

[Wreade1872]

Surely a sea monster would live in water not in a dry cave? Grendel's mother is amphibious at best, not exactly what i would consider a sea monster.

[Keith80]

Didn't the cave have access to the sea? It's a while since I read the epic but I seem to remember the combatants rolling on the floor of the cave and falling into the sea. The cave was a convenient way to leave the sea and then go marauding on land for Grendel and his mother.

[Wreade1872]

No it was the other way around, you had to leave the cave by jumping in the water like a beaver den, swim under then into the sea/lake.
Then you could swim up and out onto land. In other words the dry cave was there home, like with beavers/otters, not like sharks or something. They clearly couldn't breath under water indefinitely therefore. Call me picky but i ain't calling something a sea monster if it can't breath in the sea .